Feb 17, 2006

The real picture here is this...

The real picture here is that in a little more than a month, a gigantic "congress" is going to affect nearly 40,000 Catholic teachers, parish volunteers and youth leaders. This "congress" is blessed by and sponsored by the Ordinary of our Archdiocese. In the past and today, it is peppered with some speakers who have track records of uttering heresies and blasphemies, of sowing doubt about Catholic truth, of disobedience to the Vicar of Christ, of criticism of the Church's teaching authority, of being anti-life, of promoting the homosexual takeover agenda and of recommending and practicing abuses in the liturgy of the Holy Sacrifice of the Mass.

This situation is a danger to the souls of our fellow Catholics, especially kids. Exposing the danger is our duty in both charity and justice. Doing so is clearly not "moaning," "whining," being "surly," or spreading "hate" and "negativity."

Calling attention to attacks against Christ, His Church, the Mass and the priesthood is not going to convert the problematic speakers at "congress." Nor is it going to convert our local pro-abortion politicians, homosexual agitators and enablers, church wreckovators and devotees of liturgical abuses. No one ever said it would.

But it certainly can alert potential "congress" attendees to what is going on. It definitely can wake up people to what Holy Mass in their parish should be or should not be. And it surely can give much-needed encouragement to everyone who is already aware of the problems and is looking for allies in the fight for Catholic truth and the cause of restoring respect for everyone's God-given right to life.

We don't care about politics; we are non-partisan. Our agenda is the Catechism of the Catholic Church.

We need, and want, to hear about the good. We also need, and intend, to help our fellow Catholics recognize and reject evils that are packaged and sold as good.

28 Comments:

Anonymous Aaron said...

Dude, The money in this archdiocese comes from the westside (read: St. Monica Parish). On the westside your attitude doesn't fly. You need to romance these people. You can mock me, but I know what I am talking about. You need to CONVINCE people, not insult them. If you go the 9:30 a.m. mass at St. Monica Parish, you will find that NO ONE even realizes that traditionalists exist. If their first encounter is some blogger with an attitude, they are going to entrench themseves even deeper.

I have voiced my opinion and you have insulted me. People are Catholics because the underlying message is LOVE. They are not Catholics because the chalice is gold plated instead of glass. Now, I happen to AGREE with you on liturgical orthodoxy, but hopping around pointing fingers is a rotten way to get my point across. I hope that people will come to my way of thinking because I approach the traditional mass with love and deep, Christian faith. Not because I pointed my finger at them and hissed "you went to mass with a homosexual!!"

Jesus was furious when he entered the temple, but that fury was a) tempered and b) an isolated incident. I LIKE this blog. I think its message is crucial. I just sense too much anger in the posts and the comments. I want you to succeed in your mission. Thtat is why I am taking the time to make these comments.

9:01 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Aaron, that is so well said, I couldn't agree with you more. Thanks for posting here.

10:04 PM  
Blogger Saint Johns Army said...

aaron,
I lived in LA % Oc Ca. for 45 years and when Peter said this: We don't care about politics; we are non-partisan. Our agenda is the Catechism of the Catholic Church. He hit the nail on ther head. MOST Catholics HATE the catechism.

You said: I have voiced my opinion and you have insulted me. People are Catholics because the underlying message is LOVE.

Love IS NOT an "underlying" message. Love IS Jesus. Jesus IS the Truth. Jesus IS the Eucharist.

If you want to get romanced go to the crystal cathedral. It's on Chapman Ave a few miles from Disney. Or try St. Columbans in Garden Grove, it will make you feel good.



John

5:58 AM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

"St. Johns Army"....you are pathetic.

9:05 AM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

sorry but Jesus' anger was not "tempered" swinging a rope around and upsetting tables is not "tempered"

9:33 AM  
Blogger BaronVonMadman said...

Aaron...thanks for that post, that was literally the best thing I've read on this blog by far.

10:10 AM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Satire is always a great way to make a point and Q is very good at it. It's what makes this blog so entertaining.

I do agree with you about many traditionalists coming across as a cranky bunch. They do much harm to the cause by turning off people.

Just my two cents.

11:50 AM  
Anonymous Aaron said...

St. John's Army has very eloquently proved my point. Here I am, a traditionalist with a very rigid view of the liturgy, and he has suggested that I leave the Church for the Crystal Cathedral. Instead of real discussion and productive argument, he, like so many, resorts to smug sarcams and insults.

Wow. It could be worse than I thought.

BTW, the little speech on love is so well matched with the mean spirited rant that follows it. How sad.

2:57 PM  
Blogger skeetor said...

I don't sense anger aaron, i sense disgust, tempered and isolated.

3:18 PM  
Anonymous Gomer said...

Skeetor:

I checked out your blog. You're not very bright, are you?

3:29 PM  
Blogger Quintero said...

Aaron,

I didn't insult or mock you. And I did say we need and want to hear the good. That means hearing about good Masses.

We are in our third generation, now, that has not received good catechesis. To love them is to tell them the truth, that there are crises in the Church's hierarchy, clergy and laity.

What example does Scripture give us? They "blogged" on parchment back then, and the prophets, Apostles and evangelists had what some today would call "attitude" and did not apologize for it.

And no, by quoting them I am not likening myself to them. If we cannot quote the Bible without being accused, we are in trouble.

Was St. Timothy angry, insulting, spreading hate and failing to love and convince when he wrote:

"Now the Spirit expressly says that in after times some will depart from the Faith, giving heed to deceitful spirits and doctrines of devils..." I St. Timothy 4:1

This is just one example in the Bible. There are other examples in the Church fathers and the saints throughout history. They make Quintero look mild!

So please do tell St. Monica parishioners about traditonal Mass. But believe there is room, and need, for other approaches, too. And be understanding of people who for 10, 20, 30 and 40 years have tried deference and politeness and every approach and have seen things just get worse -- and have gotten run roughshod over for their trouble, too.

And again, there is no intent to insult or mock you or any commenter at all.

12:47 AM  
Blogger Clayton said...

Aaron,

You wrote:
The money in this archdiocese comes from the westside (read: St. Monica Parish). On the westside your attitude doesn't fly. You need to romance these people.

This is disturbing. Do you think that some people should be treated with kid gloves simply because of the size of their wallets? It's a disservice to the rich to flatter them and to cater to their falsely inflated egos. I really cannot imagine Christ doing any such thing.

8:22 AM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Ave Maria!
We are indeed on the third generation of non-catechesis. I just visited my 34 year old sister who told me she has not been to confession in over 20 years. I told her I had had a 19 year span in my life too. And was comfortable in my sins. I would not have made heaven, let me tell you.

These poor 'Catholics' have no clue to the Truths of the faith. The heirarchy has presented a false church for years and Rome had said and done nothing but allow them to continue with impunity to destroy the faith, lead souls to hell, destroy the priesthood, look the other way in times of sinful abuse.

So what do we do? lent is coming.
We need to PRAY AND FAST. Hello!
"This kind' can only be cast out with prayer and fasting. We are dealing with powers and principalities here. We have not prayed and sacrificed enough. We have suffered, it is true but we have not taken up the spiritual weapons as we must do. Evil is combatted with good and with prayer and with fasting. It is time to enter the fray with more than words.
Let us do so.

12:02 PM  
Blogger skeetor said...

gomer,

I don't think this is the place for insults on my intelligence . If you have something to say, do so at your blog or mine.

3:36 PM  
Blogger Quintero said...

Dear Skeetor,

Thank you for your support. We are in the same boat, having a few commenters insult us.

Let's hope Gomer's nasty post was a slip-up on his part and was out of character for him.

But on a related topic: Some dissenters talk a lot about love and accuse others of not having love, but reveal themselves to be mean-spirited and unloving.

4:53 PM  
Blogger Quintero said...

Dear Anonymous 12:02 p.m.,

Thank you for reminding us all of the importance of prayer and fasting and of Confession.

May your good example help lead your sister back to Confession and may it inspire the rest of us.

9:34 PM  
Anonymous Fr. Savanarola said...

Q,
You do everyone a great service by pointing out what is wrong with the Anaheim Congress.

It is a problem not only for LA and California, but for the entire Western US. Catechists who attend learn not only heresy but bad liturgy. Even those who don't buy into the nonsense, still support it, and the strange speakers, with their money.

I am a priest in a non-California diocese. At both parishes I have been pastor of, one of the first things that I have done is inform the catechists that the parish will no longer pay for them to go to the LA Congress. (They did not gave me any flack for it either once I explained my reasons.)

6:37 AM  
Anonymous Andrew S. said...

Galations 1:10

11:05 AM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Andrew S.......I fail to see how self defeating methods that won't bring about conversions will be pleasing to God

11:27 AM  
Anonymous FdS said...

1) I'm an orthodox Catholic who is appalled by much of what goes on in this Archdiocese. That said, I have been to Congress a number of times, and there are plenty of diamonds within the rough. I have seen some wonderful, faithful presentations about the Blessed Mother, about sacramental marriage and various other topics. I'm not denying all that is wrong with Congress, just saying that there's no need to toss out the baby with the bathwater by condemning the entire event. An informed attendee who chooses the right presentations -- and skips the many bad ones -- can have a truly enlightening, faith-deepening experience there.

Congress is like the Archdiocese itself -- deeply troubled, yet with plenty of good people and movements working within it.

2) As a onetime St. Monica's parishioner, I can confirm Aaron's assessment. Most of these people there are not intentionally heterodox. They have a great zeal for our lord that they pursue in sometimes misguided ways due to poor (or nonexistent) catechesis. When lovingly presented with authentic, well-explained Catholic teaching, they usually eagerly embrace it! (I, for one, witnessed flourishing support for devotions that to many seemed "new" -- Eucharistic adoration, the rosary, liturgy of the Hours.)

But the key is presenting them with the truth in a spirit of charity and generosity -- not scorn and derision.

1:16 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Fr. Savanarola....thanks for you post...surprised to hear from you after the whole "bonfire of the vanities" thing.....guess that didn't work out so well

1:52 PM  
Anonymous Andrew said...

anonymous 11:27

I agree with you. Should the Cardinal support the heretics? or the teachings of Christ? Obviously the teachings of Christ. The point is that the cardinal is giving in to heretics, and should not be.

3:38 PM  
Anonymous dave said...

Obviously we're not the only ones struggling with this issue-

http://www.splendoroftruth.com/curtjester/archives/006520.php

4:42 PM  
Blogger Quintero said...

Dear Father Savonarola,

Thank you for writing, and good for you for no longer paying for trips to "congress." You must have done a very good job of explaining your reasons, too.

May Jesus and Mary watch over you and your parishioners always.

Please keep checking back here! God bless.

5:12 PM  
Blogger Quintero said...

Dear Andrew S.,

Thank you for reminding everyone of Galatians 1:10. It and the surrounding verses have a lot to say to us. Good job!

5:25 PM  
Blogger Quintero said...

Dear fds,

Yes, I have said before, and just recently, that "congress" has many good speakers and that good does result. I have also said most attendees have good intentions.

But when the keynoter has disputed an important Vatican document in the past four months and quite a few other speakers have bad track records, then inevitably they will deceive or confuse many of the well-intentioned attendees.

And the problematic liturgies at the Masses will also deceive and confuse the attendees.

St. Monica Parish is one of many in the Archdiocese, and no one is disputing the sincerity of the parishioners. (Catholics can agree, though, that parishioner Arnold Schwarzenegger ought to repent of being pro-abortion.)

But St. Monica is not a typical parish, and this blog covers the whole Archdiocese.

Also, this blog exposes leading dissenters and the disobedient, and warns people about them.

They have all listened for a long time to charitable, generous, sincere pleas by the Popes and orthodox bishops, clergy and laity to return to orthodoxy -- and they have obstinately defied them.

So if in this blog you detect the use of irony and blunt language, please remember that it is directed not at the faithful but at the leading dissenters.

And please remember that one of the Spiritual Works of MERCY is to admonish the sinner -- in the LOVING hope of waking him up and reaching him at long last.

6:04 PM  
Anonymous alice said...

"Here I am a traditionalist with a rigid view of the liturgy"

"People are Catholics because the underlying message is love. They are not Catholics because the chalice is gold plated instead of glass"

Somehow these two statements seem to counterdict each other-are there 2 aarons?

4:47 PM  
Blogger Quintero said...

Dear Alice,

You make a good point about Mass. Thanks for contributing.

Love and obedience are connected, aren't they? "If you love Me, keep My commandments." Priests and bishops must obey the Church in everything, and especially in the way they say Mass.

8:46 PM  

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